See this is why I only take a normal, boring multivitamin. Also the l-methylfolate I need to counteract a generic defect so that my complex cocktail of antidepressants can keep me from self terminating. It’s not that I want to live longer, but I’ve got family obligations that make it kinda worth it.
Yeah… it’s the …supplements causing my liver disease. Definitely not the heavy drinking I need to cope with the last several years of absolute bullshit! Lol
Hey now… let’s be fair, it could be both.
Honestly, just combining alcohol with acetaminophen/paracetamol will do a number on your liver. Or just skip the alcohol. That stuff is in everything these days - no need to get crazy with “supplements.”
or it could a third thing we don’t even know about yet.
I suspect this has more to do with an increase of soft drink and energy drink consumption, causing people to drink less water. Supplements shouldn’t be any more harmful to you than the food you eat. Linking it to supplements is an example of correlation does not mean causation, and I think big pharma has an axe to grind because they can’t patent most supplements.
people are taking mega doses of vitamin A.
The federal LiverTox database is a free tool highlighting medicines and supplements linked to liver injury.
Where’s the database of supplements proven to be effective? Without that we should just stop using them, and then we don’t need to worry about their safety anymore.
Is it any good? The appearance of testimonials on the front page is a big red flag for me.
Edit: Do you have an account? I wanted to see what they had to say about the effectiveness of Oscillococcinum from Boiron. It’s a treatment, not a supplement, but it seems to be listed. That would be a litmus test for me.
It’s provided by many academic medical centers to their staff as a resource, so I think it’s broadly trusted by medical providers. Looks like it’s pretty expensive to subscribe, that’s too bad.
It gives a 5/10 for Oscillococcinum. It says there is insufficient evidence to rate its effectiveness for COVID-19, COPD, and influenza and sites several studies on each, giving a summary of their findings. Regarding safety, it says it is “possibly safe when used orally.” It’s associated with angioedema but otherwise appears to have no adverse effects.
Thanks for sharing the info. Unfortunately, in the past 10-15 years a lot of medical centers, including very prestigious ones, have incorporated CAM in an effort to appease patients.
It’s good that they’re giving it a low rating, but it should be lower. It’s goose liver diluted until nothing remains. It was originally thought to treat flu because when dissected under a microscope, there were small coccus-shaped things in goose liver thought to resemble the microorganisms associated with flu. We now know that flu is caused by a virus that is invisible to those microscopes.
These is zero plausibility that Oscillococcinum or any other truly homeopathic cure (I’m excluding low dilutions like Zicam) even could work, so any evidence supporting it will be highly suspect.
That’s interesting. To provide a bit of insight, I think it has the rating that it does because it doesn’t appear to be overtly harmful (which makes sense if it’s just diluted liver), and lower ratings are reserved for dangerous supplements or those with many adverse effects/interactions with other things
Some supplements are proven to be effective and having all information in one database would be useful but who is going to create the database?
The FDA.
That’s an incredibly long list.
Depends on your definitions of “proven” and “effective.” The actual effects of that supplement need to be evaluated, not just what that chemical normally does in the body. It needs to cite large double-blind, placebo-controlled clinical trials.
The biggest one imo is vitamin D. It’s proposed by the science averse community as a cure all to Covid and Measles. What those do their own research morons never bother to look into is that A, D, E and K are fat soluble vitamins, and excessive supplementation with them can mess up your liver. You don’t need to supplement any of these vitamins unless you have a deficiency and a doctor tells you to.
Niacin could also be a culprit as larger doses have been linked to liver issues.
Edit: Hell, all of the “B” vitamins could be included with the prevalence of them in energy drinks
Vitamin D is actually very safe at normal doses despite being fat soluble. You have to be taking huge amounts daily for it to become an issue (which maybe they are idk)
Most multivitamins/supplements/whatever have WAY more than the recommended daily amounts.
RDA is min required to prevent disease. There is also a max dosage, upper limit, after which it is toxic.
Sure, but going over 100% “daily value” does not equal toxic. You generally have to be taking well over 4000 IU vitamin D daily to reach toxic levels.
Having known people who prefer supplements to actual medical care, I can attest to “megadosing” of vitamins being common in these communities.
I admit I don’t know at what point the dose becomes unsafe, but I’d imagine that taking a 1000 IU tablet daily plus the additional natural vitamin D intake could be problematic longterm.
I’d imagine that taking a 1000 IU tablet daily plus the additional natural vitamin D intake could be problematic longterm.
For healthy adults, it’s safe
Thanks, it looks like vitamin D is definitely one of the harder ones to get too much of naturally.
Other sources suggest much lower upper limits, but still a lot higher than you’re going to get via sunlight and diet.
This study found 3.2% of participants were getting over 4,000 IU daily in 2013-2014 (vs <0.1% about a decade prior). That trend of increased intake has probably continued, so stats for a more recent year would be pretty interesting.
I also didn’t realise you could get vitamin D supplements as high as 10,000 IU without a prescription, so I’m sure there will be people taking that regularly without good reason to do so.
Seems safe based on this doc. https://youtu.be/uAfVC4l5uZ0 but it seems like need other nutrients that works with d3 to keep it safe or beneficial for the body.
RDA value is just the min required to prevent disease. The toxicity level is much higher.
Less what your doctor says, more what your blood test results say for Vitamin D levels.
Can vitamin K really cause liver damage? If I remember correctly, even extremely high doses (45 mg) of vitamin K2 were safe and well tolerated.
It’s possible. I’m not a Dr, but my understanding is that with water soluble vitamins, you pee out any excess, so it’s no big deal, but the fat soluble ones, any excess is stored in the liver, so in theory, anything your body is not using is going to and getting stored in the liver, making it do extra work unnecessarily, and just piling up there; likely enlarging your liver in the process.
By comparison, the 2017–2018 National Health and Nutrition Examination Survey showed that 58% of adults 20 and older had used a dietary supplement in the past 30 days.
“I think people assume these things are safe,” said Dr. Dina Halegoua-De Marzio, a Jefferson Health hepatologist who treated Grafton. “The No. 1 reason we see people taking these are for good health or to supplement their health, and so I don’t think that they realize that there is a real risk here.”
Nutritional supplements are where a number of products that haven’t actually met the bar to be a medicine go.
https://www.usada.org/dietary-supplements/medications-vs-supplements/
Given that they are both used for health purposes, it would be easy to assume that medications and supplements are regulated the same way and produced to the same standards, but unfortunately this is not the case. Unlike medications, supplements are regulated post-market, which means that no regulatory body evaluates the contents or safety of supplements before they are sold to consumers. Take a look below to learn more about the many differences between medications and supplements, and how those differences make supplement use risky for athletes.
MEDICATIONS
FDA Review
The U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) maintains a comprehensive evaluation process for medications, assessing everything including the packaging, the design of clinical trials, and the manufacturing conditions.
Reliable Ingredient Labels
Medications must list every ingredient on the Drug Facts label, and these ingredients are confirmed through quality control analysis by the FDA.
Proven Safe Before Sale
To help protect consumers, medications are subject to strict premarket regulation, which means they go through a rigorous safety and efficacy evaluation process before reaching consumers.
SUPPLEMENTS
No FDA Review
Supplements don’t undergo any evaluation process or testing by the FDA before they are made available to consumers. In fact, most supplement companies are never inspected by the FDA to ensure manufacturing best practices.
Unreliable Ingredient Labels
Manufacturers may misidentify prohibited substances on Supplement Facts labels, or they may fail to list prohibited substances altogether.
Proven Unsafe Before Sale
Because they are regulated post-market, supplements are sold to consumers until it becomes evident that they are harmful following consumer adverse event reporting. Even then, supplements with illegal or dangerous ingredients may remain on shelves for years.
It’s actually worse than you’re making it sound.
Supplements are not just less regulated than drugs, they’re less regulated than food.
And how many people are buying no-name Chinese supplement brands on Amazon, too. It blows my mind that people buy stuff they put in their body from those brands. I wonder if people just assume that they’re regulated/inspected like food or real drugs.
